Student & Teacher clash

[Jena]

I was wondering if someone could give me a little advice. My son is in the second grade and is a gifted student. Unfortunately, his "arguing" to his teacher is in the makes of him becoming a lawyer by the time he's 10! He really does not mean to be disrespectful, it's just that he's got this unfortnate habit of justifying everything he does. For example:

teacher: Please do not talk while during lunch time.

my son: I was just trying to help my friend open up his bag of chips.

As I could only imagine (I go through this ALL the time), his teacher is fed up with the comments. I have repeatedly talked with my son about talking back and if he's got anything to say, to just respect his teacher by saying "yes ma'am". I've even punished him. Everyday he comes home with 3 check marks in his folder, just enough to where he doesn't have to go to the Principal's office. You know the saying.. "children should be seen and not heard"? That seems to be the case here. My son isn't allowed to say hardly anything to her! I am as frustrated as he is. I actually had a little conference with her and it seems like it went no where. HELP!!!!

By the way, she sends home a folder with check marks but I have no idea what he did wrong. Would it be too overbearing to ask her to write in his folder his errors? Thanks ahead of time.
Sorry for all the mispellings or what not. I am at work and need to get back to my office! Ahhh!!!!
:wowee:

[Brit]

I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for some indication of what your son is doing that equals a checkmark. Maybe she can set up a more in-depth check-list, so that if he does not follow instructions a check goes in that column, if he disrupts, a check in that column, and so forth. I don't think it would be much more work, other than setting up the list.

If I were the teacher, I might feel that the "justifying" is about testing authority, which would make me draw a hard and fast line. Also, I'm sure as a parent you know the feeling of not wanting to have to justify everything that you request or expect.

Perhaps you could work with your son on picking his battles -- deciding when it's important for him to be right (which should be rarely) and when he can accept the teacher's point of view. Perhaps help him learn a way of politely offering his side of the story, too? something like "Yes, Ma'am, I appologise. May I explain my side of the story?" and if she says no, then no it is.

Just one opinion. Best of luck.

[Jena]

If I were the teacher, I might feel that the "justifying" is about testing authority, which would make me draw a hard and fast line. Also, I'm sure as a parent you know the feeling of not wanting to have to justify everything that you request or expect.

Boy do I! We go 'round and 'round. Sometimes he is too smart for his own good but yes, it gets utterly annoying. I feel sorry for his teacher.

Perhaps help him learn a way of politely offering his side of the story, too? something like "Yes, Ma'am, I appologise. May I explain my side of the story?" and if she says no, then no it is.

Just one opinion. Best of luck.

There have been times when I thought that he should have been able to justify what he's been accused of (such as taking note in class when she thought he wasn't paying attention), but she doesn't allow her students to speak at all when spoken to. By asking to answer, he has at least tried to approach her in a polite way. I will pass this advice along to him. I think that is a really great source of wisdom. Thank you very much for sharing your opinion. :waving:

[Karenrbw]

My son is very much like that. Every time I tell him to stop doing something, he has to justify himself. We have been fighting this all summer. When you find a plausible solution, please share it with us.

[Boxcar]

I've had students like this. Here are some of the things I try:

Moving on before he can respond. I'll conclude wit a "thank you" and already be zeroing in on the next kid. (We are quiet at lunch, Matt. Thank you.)

Justifying back. I like to streach thier logical horzons at times. (You can help your friend without talking.)

Misinterprete their behavior. (Since you like to be so helpful, you can help me pick up after lunch while everyone else goes to recess. We'll work on helping without talking then. OR You are are talking, so you must be done with lunch. Since you are so focusd on what your friend is doing, I guess you need a new activity.)

Reprimand and re-direct. (We don't answer back, Matt. Now, please work on the rest of your lunch or take your trash to the basket.)

I personally like the children in my classes to make choices and discuss the logic behind thier actions. So, it would be worth it for me to tell the child "I will ask when I want to know the reason why you did something." That way, I tach the child about talking back but still allow him to explore his logical foundations.

[Jena]

As a parent, I think this would work well. I would beat him to the punch if I explained why I did something before he had the chance to ask. That would take care of it, seemingly. Hmm.. never thought of that before. Thanks Boxcar! I will be sure to try that. If the problem persists in the classroom, I'll let the teacher know how I've been handling the problem. I really think that this will work. I am sure his teacher is on her wits end, bless her.

[Oak Tree]

I think part of the problem is illustrated by your thread title. It shouldn't read 'Student & Teacher clash' it should read 'Student Fails to Follow Expectations'.

[teacher5]

Jena- Your son has his agenda and the teacher has hers. I totally agree with Boxcar. The teacher needs to pay less attention to him and move onto the next kid. Also, the misinterpretation and rechannelling of energy to do something not as much fun and more productive often helps, too. His teacher needs to set something (with choices) up not only for him, but for any child who finishes work early. Also, these choices need to be appealing and challenging. As he matures and he will, he does need to learn to handle "down time" more independently and recognize expectations with greater clarity. Good luck!